Comments on: Reckless Endangerment: The Suicide Slot http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/ Encouragement, Education & Advocacy for Bicycling in the Real World Sun, 12 Feb 2012 02:14:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: motorbike helmets http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-2214 motorbike helmets Thu, 07 May 2009 12:43:16 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-2214 I have to agree above, i think they put the lane their to appear like they advocate bikers but in reality they really have no real desire to help or grow bikers, they just see it as more road ways to worry about even though they don't take care of the road ways anyways. I have to agree above, i think they put the lane their to appear like they advocate bikers but in reality they really have no real desire to help or grow bikers, they just see it as more road ways to worry about even though they don’t take care of the road ways anyways.

]]> By: A Tale of Two Infrastructures | Carbon Trace http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-429 A Tale of Two Infrastructures | Carbon Trace Tue, 11 Nov 2008 18:29:07 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-429 [...] to create bicycle infrastructure on the cheap, i.e. paint instead of asphalt and modern technology. Commute Orlando discusses what we see in the picture below: the idiotic choices made by those who would rather paint than [...] [...] to create bicycle infrastructure on the cheap, i.e. paint instead of asphalt and modern technology. Commute Orlando discusses what we see in the picture below: the idiotic choices made by those who would rather paint than [...]

]]> By: Keri http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-428 Keri Tue, 11 Nov 2008 17:28:11 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-428 Nick, I understand your frustration. Our land-use patterns have really boxed us into costly and/or imperfect solutions. Once you get into the urban core, your choices increase and it's easier to pick roads that suit your needs. But getting from the sprawl zone into town offers few options. Arterial roads pose problems for implementing bikes lanes because of the complexity of freeway interchanges and commercial districts. The greater the crossing and turning movements (conflict opportunities), the greater the need for a cyclist to avoid the space where bike lanes would be. A lane position which allows you to protect your safety and control your environment is much farther left than a bike lane. In such an environment, the opportunity for really bad compromises on the part of designers and/or deadly mistakes on the part of contractors is great. And the photos in this post show the common result. Nick, I understand your frustration. Our land-use patterns have really boxed us into costly and/or imperfect solutions. Once you get into the urban core, your choices increase and it’s easier to pick roads that suit your needs. But getting from the sprawl zone into town offers few options.

Arterial roads pose problems for implementing bikes lanes because of the complexity of freeway interchanges and commercial districts. The greater the crossing and turning movements (conflict opportunities), the greater the need for a cyclist to avoid the space where bike lanes would be. A lane position which allows you to protect your safety and control your environment is much farther left than a bike lane. In such an environment, the opportunity for really bad compromises on the part of designers and/or deadly mistakes on the part of contractors is great. And the photos in this post show the common result.

]]> By: nick http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-425 nick Tue, 11 Nov 2008 16:50:53 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-425 sorry again for the rant. if there are any bicycle groups that are working with the city and planning boards please post it here because i would really love to get involved. Thanks! sorry again for the rant. if there are any bicycle groups that are working with the city and planning boards please post it here because i would really love to get involved. Thanks!

]]> By: nick http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-423 nick Tue, 11 Nov 2008 16:42:01 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-423 since moving here a few months ago i've been scratching my head trying to figure out how they come up with the bike lane placement. are they doing any studies on bike traffic patterns? there will be a bike lane and then bang, nothing! and then your screwed because pretty much that lane took you nowhere and now you have to share the narrow street with 35-40mph cars. Like the pictures above with the bike lanes on the right of a turning lane! i live out in waterford lakes area and luckily i have a short commute to orange and princeton about 6 days a week and luckily i'm able to combine some trails into the commute or I would be stuck with lake underhill(bike lane for a short distance and then it narrows to a 2 lane road) or colonial which i would have to ride on alafaya with no bike lane until after colonial and then well, you know colonial(hell). I just dont get these lanes. it seems like they just do it when and where it is convenient. oh we have some extra space here, we will put a bike lane here. oh this cobblestone street has a smooth cement ditch on each side, lets make that a bike lane. Does this city promote bike lane usage? is it encouraging bicyclist to use the streets and bike lanes? magnolia bike lane going towards colonial seems that it has turned into a long turning lane for cars to just speed up to the light. everytime im riding and someone tries to speed up behind me in a car in a bike lane, i will slow down, not let them pass and point to the bike lane and then if i have the chance i try to talk to them same with people yelling to "get on the sidewalk" get out of the street" if i catch with them at a light i ask them why i should be on the sidewalk? then i explain 3 simple things. 1. more accidents occur when bikes are on sidewalks. 2. its called a sideWALK!! 3. its illegal to ride on the sidewalk in orlando! *sigh* sorry, i'm just frustrated and venting. anyways im sure everyone has heard these before but if not here are a few suggestions that i've picked up from riding as a messenger over the years.. 1. while riding close to cars either parked or in traffic, learn to use THEIR mirrors especially while riding in that danger door zone. i'm always looking in the car through rear window and also looking in the mirrors to see any movement. 2. make eye contact and when someone is polite then shoot them a nod or a wave. 3. ride like a car. these pictures are a prime example of HORRIBLE design! there might as well not even be a bike lane... I find it easier and safer to not even use the bike lane sometimes and this is a prime example. 4. wear a helmet :) since moving here a few months ago i’ve been scratching my head trying to figure out how they come up with the bike lane placement. are they doing any studies on bike traffic patterns? there will be a bike lane and then bang, nothing! and then your screwed because pretty much that lane took you nowhere and now you have to share the narrow street with 35-40mph cars. Like the pictures above with the bike lanes on the right of a turning lane! i live out in waterford lakes area and luckily i have a short commute to orange and princeton about 6 days a week and luckily i’m able to combine some trails into the commute or I would be stuck with lake underhill(bike lane for a short distance and then it narrows to a 2 lane road) or colonial which i would have to ride on alafaya with no bike lane until after colonial and then well, you know colonial(hell). I just dont get these lanes. it seems like they just do it when and where it is convenient. oh we have some extra space here, we will put a bike lane here. oh this cobblestone street has a smooth cement ditch on each side, lets make that a bike lane. Does this city promote bike lane usage? is it encouraging bicyclist to use the streets and bike lanes? magnolia bike lane going towards colonial seems that it has turned into a long turning lane for cars to just speed up to the light.
everytime im riding and someone tries to speed up behind me in a car in a bike lane, i will slow down, not let them pass and point to the bike lane and then if i have the chance i try to talk to them same with people yelling to “get on the sidewalk” get out of the street” if i catch with them at a light i ask them why i should be on the sidewalk? then i explain 3 simple things.
1. more accidents occur when bikes are on sidewalks.
2. its called a sideWALK!!
3. its illegal to ride on the sidewalk in orlando!

*sigh*
sorry, i’m just frustrated and venting.
anyways im sure everyone has heard these before but if not here are a few suggestions that i’ve picked up from riding as a messenger over the years..
1. while riding close to cars either parked or in traffic, learn to use THEIR mirrors especially while riding in that danger door zone. i’m always looking in the car through rear window and also looking in the mirrors to see any movement.
2. make eye contact and when someone is polite then shoot them a nod or a wave.
3. ride like a car. these pictures are a prime example of HORRIBLE design! there might as well not even be a bike lane… I find it easier and safer to not even use the bike lane sometimes and this is a prime example.
4. wear a helmet :)

]]> By: Eric http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-421 Eric Tue, 11 Nov 2008 15:03:57 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-421 Yesterday I was in Oviedo and was surprised at the number of bikes lanes going right up to the intersection. Some have been sort of fixed, with a dashed line about 25 feet long, others not. That's a State highway, just like 17/92 is in Debary, so this must be a FDOT thing. I don't think FDOT let's the cities touch the State highways. Yesterday I was in Oviedo and was surprised at the number of bikes lanes going right up to the intersection. Some have been sort of fixed, with a dashed line about 25 feet long, others not.

That’s a State highway, just like 17/92 is in Debary, so this must be a FDOT thing. I don’t think FDOT let’s the cities touch the State highways.

]]> By: Keri http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-409 Keri Mon, 10 Nov 2008 19:24:38 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-409 I've ridden on that section of 17-92 many times. The width varies, but I think you're right, it's more a visual lane-narrowing scheme than a bike facility. The powers that be love their <a href="http://bicyclingmatters.wordpress.com/infrastructure/do-bike-lane-stripes-calm-motor-traffic/" rel="nofollow">junk science justifications</a> for that 'cause they get themselves a twofer. And sadly, most cyclists will ride on any amount of pavement to the right of a white stripe... even if it's narrower than they are. When we do our Blue Springs rides, we ride in the right lane and ignore the stripes. I’ve ridden on that section of 17-92 many times. The width varies, but I think you’re right, it’s more a visual lane-narrowing scheme than a bike facility. The powers that be love their junk science justifications for that ’cause they get themselves a twofer. And sadly, most cyclists will ride on any amount of pavement to the right of a white stripe… even if it’s narrower than they are.

When we do our Blue Springs rides, we ride in the right lane and ignore the stripes.

]]> By: Eric http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-408 Eric Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:35:33 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-408 I was in Debary last week and saw some double white stripes, maybe 18-24" apart on some of 17/92. No idea what that is about. Looks like they are taking a 14' outside lane and trying to make it 12' by way of paint. I was in Debary last week and saw some double white stripes, maybe 18-24″ apart on some of 17/92. No idea what that is about.

Looks like they are taking a 14′ outside lane and trying to make it 12′ by way of paint.

]]> By: Keri http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-407 Keri Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:11:37 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-407 Lakemont has a striping issue at Whitehall (mainly an issue for northbound cyclists). Generally, as bike lanes go, Lakemont isn't terribly offensive (I would prefer a WCL, of course). The real tragedy is Baldwin Park. <a href="http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/07/10/the-swinging-door/#baldwin" rel="nofollow">These DZBLs</a> are criminal, both in the immediate risk and the mis-education they provide. Since the city refuses to remove the lanes, they should at least caution-stripe them. <a href="http://kbird.com/ftp/cycling/Baldwinstripeoff.jpg" rel="nofollow">Like this.</a> Since they define the hazard zone, completely. There are several suicide slots in town, too. I know a few of them, Mighk probably has a longer list. Lyndy was actually able to get a few of them re-striped (or caution-striped) in the Oviedo area. Lakemont has a striping issue at Whitehall (mainly an issue for northbound cyclists). Generally, as bike lanes go, Lakemont isn’t terribly offensive (I would prefer a WCL, of course).

The real tragedy is Baldwin Park. These DZBLs are criminal, both in the immediate risk and the mis-education they provide. Since the city refuses to remove the lanes, they should at least caution-stripe them. Like this. Since they define the hazard zone, completely.

There are several suicide slots in town, too. I know a few of them, Mighk probably has a longer list. Lyndy was actually able to get a few of them re-striped (or caution-striped) in the Oviedo area.

]]> By: Eric http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/2008/11/08/reckless-endangerment-the-suicide-slot/comment-page-1/#comment-406 Eric Mon, 10 Nov 2008 17:17:41 +0000 http://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/?p=1292#comment-406 Mighk wrote: I’ve yet to hear any response other than, “We’ll fix it the next time we resurface.” It's going to be a long, long time until Lakemont needs resurfacing again. Maybe a slurry job in 5 years, though. Mighk wrote:
I’ve yet to hear any response other than, “We’ll fix it the next time we resurface.”

It’s going to be a long, long time until Lakemont needs resurfacing again. Maybe a slurry job in 5 years, though.

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